Fate/Apocrypha - Episode 2 Discussion / Poll

[PentingWolf]

Originally Posted by GDB

I hope there's an Iskander-like character too. I'm thinking Mordred or Astolfo is supposed to fill that role, given how forefront they were in the promotional art and such. But it'd be hard to fill that sort of "larger than life" thing Iskander had going.

Astolfo can fill that role very well, since he also plays the role of MC's big bro, besides being one of MC's love interests alongside Jeanne.

[quigonkenny]

Originally Posted by shmaster

More precisely, Strange Fake is a timeline that's considered as "both".
While FGO is more of a "neither" category, in their ways if being exception of the rule.

And I did my research on the Waver verse now.
The 27 does not exist there. DA composed of them are mentioned, but they are just DA and not the 27.

There is no concept of prime continuity in Type Moon franchise anymore.
It is now only about "which quantum clock the timeline is on".

Any thing counts at this point as every quantum clock is valid.

As long a world is a "branch world" it is a full fledged valid world.
There is no world that is more prime than the other, unless the said world is "trimmed" world.

The actual in universe explanation is that due to the quantum clock of the FGO world got burned down, the history of that world fell into an ambiguous and undefined state that allows the possibility of other timelines to get mixed in. (Why even true anomaly like Goddess Rhongomyniad can arrive into FGO world.)
Thus the FGO world got broken into something different from it supposed to be, which probably is where the "neither" state came from.

I meant "prime" in the "shares continuity with FSN" sense, rather than any kind of official meaning. They're all valid settings, of course. And where is it you're getting your "quantum clock" information?

[shmaster]

Quantum Clock?

The full definition is in Fate/Extella.
Then Nasu provided some supplemental info later on.

[quigonkenny]

Originally Posted by shmaster

Fate/Extella.

This probably explains why I hadn't heard about it before...

[belatkuro]

Quantum Time Lock.

[quigonkenny]

Originally Posted by belatkuro

Quantum Time Lock.

Wibbley wobbley timey wimey...

[shmaster]

Originally Posted by belatkuro

Quantum Time Lock.

Thanks for the correction.

[Dengar]

The Quantum Time Lock isn't all that complicated. Reality occasionally trims insignificant timelines in order to avoid the continuum from being overloaded with possibilities. Generally it takes a group of incredibly similar timelines and chooses one of them to perpetuate.

[Twi]

So reality just decides that a timeline has to go and obliterates it and everything in it?

Nasuverse really is a horror setting.

[shmaster]

Originally Posted by Twi

So reality just decides that a timeline has to go and obliterates it and everything in it?

Nasuverse really is a horror setting.

The cosmos determines a timeline's worthiness on whether it still has the potential to generate more possibilities.
A Quantum Time Lock will placed on the time where significant history defining event that perpetuate possibilities as a save point by the Cosmos.
All histories are forced to pass by Time Lock so possibilities can stay abundant in as many worlds as possible. Like in Extella, after "Moon Cell has been defended" has registered as a Quantum Time Lock, all the parallel worlds that has Moon Cell are locked into the Time Lock and no worlds will enter the future that Moon Cell is destroyed.

And as the timeline flow by the Time Lock, those worlds continues to have diminishing possibilities will be trimmed away by the Cosmos. Cosmos will stop supply energy into those timelines, and those worlds will slowly deteriorate.

[Obelisk ze Tormentor]

^ The Cosmos can’t handle unlimited possibilities so it decided to trim (aka. destroy) worlds and timelines? Well, that’s certainly not a universe I want to live in .

[shmaster]

I should add, those world that's considered to have diminishing possibilities are the worlds that went too extreme.

Like an apocalyptic world where most people are dead, thus not even life around to make things happen. The Cosmos will deem it unfruitful and trim it away.
The opposite is also true. Like a world where everyone lives happily ever after with no suffering. Since everyone will just continue to be happy in those type of world and nothing else is going to happen, the Cosmos will also trim it away.

[Obelisk ze Tormentor]

^ The former is understandable, but the latter is all sorta messed-up. Basically when a timeline reached a true utopia where everybody lives happily ever after the Cosmos will just eliminate it due to lack of possibilities? And here I thought 'Moonlight Butterfly' in Turn-A Gundam was bad .

[shmaster]

Yes, in Nasuverse, the idea of infinite energy does not exist. Not even the Cosmos itself has it.
In other words, the Cosmos does not have what it takes to support every single timeline out there.
Some just has to be terminated for the Cosmos' continue survival.
And the rule that got established is those are rich in possibilities get to stay, those aren't have to go.
Because the worlds that no longer change is meaningless.

[Obelisk ze Tormentor]

^ Then I truly felt bad for all the good and heroic souls who have sacrificed their lives and loved ones to reach the utopias that got obliterated by the Cosmos (and also the poor innocent people who lived in them) .

[shadow1296]

Originally Posted by Obelisk ze Tormentor

^ Then I truly felt bad for all the good and heroic souls who have sacrificed their lives and loved ones to reach the utopias that got obliterated by the Cosmos (and also the poor innocent people who lived in them) .

think of it in the meta way, the cosmos is a writer and the timelines are just some of the stories he's written, what' the point of continuing a story where everyone achieved their happy or a story where the world literally ended none really, so the writer(cosmos) stops putting energy into them

[shmaster]

Originally Posted by Obelisk ze Tormentor

^ Then I truly felt bad for all the good and heroic souls who have sacrificed their lives and loved ones to reach the utopias that got obliterated by the Cosmos (and also the poor innocent people who lived in them) .

Feel sorry for the opposite too. Quantum Time Lock is there to lock timelines into a path where the possibilities can remain abundant.
And the Time Lock can bind the timeline into some terribly unhappy events as long as it produce a high amount of possibilities.

Speaking of which, a popular theory among the fans is that Tsukihime world always end up as the Earth of Steel, and all the magus and DA who tried to avoid that fate (including Xion) failed in one way or another because the Cosmos already Quantum Time Locked the Tsukihime history down to that path.

Every Xion fan out there is praying day and night that this theory won't come true, or else all her effort will end inf utility no matter how hard she tries. (And at worst case scenario, always end up becoming the Dust of Osiris.)

[Obelisk ze Tormentor]

Originally Posted by shadow1296

think of it in the meta way, the cosmos is a writer and the timelines are just some of the stories he's written, what' the point of continuing a story where everyone achieved their happy or a story where the world literally ended none really, so the writer(cosmos) stops putting energy into them

Originally Posted by shmaster

Feel sorry for the opposite too. Quantum Time Lock is there to lock timelines into a path where the possibilities can remain abundant.
And the Time Lock can bind the timeline into some terribly unhappy events as long as it produce a high amount of possibilities.

So the Cosmos has the working ethics of a mangaka who doesn’t want his edgy work to end? But at least when it comes to writers, the universe of the stories that he finished won't get obliterated when he left it untouched after the endings (except for the nihilistic endings where they lead to universe's destruction).

The Cosmos sounds like a gritty-action author that’ll continue to make more conflicts and suffering and whatever else it takes to prevent his work from being cancelled even if that means screwing most of the characters. It’s funny how this particular aspect of animangames & novel industry is addressed head-on by Re:Creators within its story .

Speaking of which, a popular theory among the fans is that Tsukihime world always end up as the Earth of Steel, and all the magus and DA who tried to avoid that fate (including Xion) failed in one way or another because the Cosmos already Quantum Time Locked the Tsukihime history down to that path.

Every Xion fan out there is praying day and night that this theory won't come true, or else all her effort will end inf utility no matter how hard she tries. (And at worst case scenario, always end up becoming the Dust of Osiris.)

Fortunately, I was never a fan of Xion in Tsuki so either way is fine for me .

[Yu Ominae]

Originally Posted by Obelisk ze Tormentor

So the Cosmos has the working ethics of a mangaka who doesn’t want his edgy work to end? But at least when it comes to writers, the universe of the stories that he finished won't get obliterated when he left it untouched after the endings (except for the nihilistic endings where they lead to universe's destruction).

The Cosmos sounds like a gritty-action author that’ll continue to make more conflicts and suffering and whatever else it takes to prevent his work from being cancelled even if that means screwing most of the characters. It’s funny how this particular aspect of animangames & novel industry is addressed head-on by Re:Creators within its story .

Man, can't help but think this is how fanfic writers/novel authors do their stories.

[Twi]

I thought it was Sion, and Nasuverse is regardless a horrible world to live in.