[Manga] Neji's power or Sasuke's wrath?

[Hunter]

Originally Posted by UserName

Gaara' jutsu are basically instant kill, and they are also instant speed. Sasuke won't be able to see them coming if he did, he still cnat jump out of the way of a tsunami or sand or fly off the ground thats swallowing hiim.(Unless he CAN fly.... which we don't know...).

Just about that, since when Gaara's jutsus are "instant speed"?

Anyway could Sasuke beat Gaara?
Frankly that would be an insanely difficult fight for Sasuke, Gaara just became too strong even if anything's possible.

Gaara started the fight against Kimi in a way which would have allowed Sasuke to have easily the edge given that he's way faster than Gaara's sand, if Sasuke used instantaneously his Chidori at close contact with his high speed Gaara could be beaten quickly. But let's be fair : that will never happen this way.
Gaara's abilities to create sand from the ground and to catch the opponent's legs is almost flawless, the only way to avoid that for Sasuke would be to remain at high speed constantly to avoid that Gaara would aim the sand at his position
But then remain the biggest threat, the desert avalanche.

It's very difficult to imagine Sasuke avoiding this attack in his current state.
Jumping above seems to be out of question and I don't really think that Sasuke can fly.
Maybe Sasuke in CS lvl 2 could protect himself by surrounding his body with his wings as in a cocoon or simply a direct attack with the blackish Chidori directly through the wave of sand, kinda like Gunnm Last Order in the volume 4 for those who knows this extremely good series ^^

But all in all except for some twists due to storyline reason (which is always the most important point in a fight ) I think that Gaara should win given what they both showed up until now.

THey both can read moves, they both are fast. Sasuke can run fast, but Neji's movements (such as wehn striking) is amazingly fast.

No.
If the Sharingan can read through Taijutsu, it's not the case for the Byakugan.
As much as you like to repeat that, it doesn't change that it wasn't presented like a capacity of this bloodline.
Neji can see almost everything but that's it. It's not just because you can see that you can predict accordingly what the opponent will do next.

Sasuke will have to go close range against neji, the only long range jutsu he knows is katon, and that can be dodged since it seems whenever he does it, team 7 seems to know what he's going to do. In Close range, without a doubt, Neji is better. So I'd say Neji.

It's true that Neji is able to avoid a Katon but this is where the full Sharingan would be extremely good.
Because Sasuke would see in advance how and where Neji will avoid his Katon and thus to attack him with kunai or else at the moments where Neji is the most vulnerable. With that Sasuke can easily force Neji to use and use the Kaiten way too often.

Besides we saw Sasuke able to avoid every blows and beat without being even touched an opponent way faster than him.
If Sasuke doesn't have any problem to predict perfectly and avoid accordingly any attack from an opponent incredibly faster than him then he wouldn't have a problem to do that against an opponent slower than him.
The fact is that if Neji can't touch Sasuke then the awesome avantage given by the Jyuken is completely negated but for the Kaiten.

[aptenergy]

Originally Posted by Hunter

Now that Sasuke has a full Sharingan and can predict completely his moves and given that he even faster than him, the last ace of Neji is the Kaiten.

I know this has been argued before, but I don't think Sasuke can see that well.

That would mean that Sasuke vs. Kimimaro, Sasuke vs. Gai, Sasuke vs. Drunken Lee, and Sasuke vs. Neji would all be pointless battles (speaking of taijutsu stuff only). Anything involving taijutsu = no effect on a Sharingan user. I don't know about you, but that seems extremely, extremely overpowered.

Spoiler for discussion on my versus battles:

I'm treating Gai as a ultra taijutsu master. Sure, Gai is extremely fast. But that if Sasuke can prepare for Gai's attacks, then speed won't matter at all - and from my understanding of the three-dot Sharingan, it tries to see [some time period] in advance, so AFAICT Sasuke would be able to read Gai's moves even better than he would read Lee's.

If you try to say that Sharingan immediately understands the ... principles behind some taijutsu style, then you might be able to say that Sasuke would immediately extract all of Kimimaro's dances from just one of them. You might even be able to say that the second Kimimaro starts running at Sasuke, Sasuke would say, "dude, I just owned the Kaguya clan's style" and begin to own him. I can say that Sasuke was able to learn Lee's taijutsu based off of the moves he's seen - that Sharingan aided him in forming the principles behind the style and thus all the moves. But I don't think it's that simple to extrapolate fighting techniques.

What I do think is that Sharingan combines two things: it sees where an attack will land based on their physical movements, and it gives the user the experience that a normal taijutsu user would have in analyzing someone's technique.

That slants a fight in Sasuke's favor, but it does not guarantee him 100% victory.

There is no doubt in my mind that a three dot Sharingan would give you a very impressive edge over the competition. But Sasuke vs. Naruto is not a comprehensive example - Naruto always uses very very simple taijutsu.

Neji would be overwhelmed by a Sasuke level 2. But I don't think any of the Konoha 5 would have been able to take Kidoumaru other than him, so that's a testament to Neji's skill. IMO Neji would have no issues defeating a Sasuke level 1.

And on Gaara, I was absolutely impressed by Gaara vs. Kimimaro. Gaara had some really, really outstanding jutsu that he was using, and he didn't even really seem to be breaking a sweat as he launched avalanches of sand and made his shield of sand. If he spent all battles hovering on a cushion of sand, that would give him the air advantage, and if he were fighting in a desert... I think Sasuke level 2 would have a very, very, very rough time handling Gaara.

Not to mention that Gaara was mentally stable the entire time.

[nh1]

Originally Posted by Bflip

Spoiler:

Wow he can fly. Forgetting something about Sasuke's CSL2 form?

Yeah, no shit Gaara can control sand. Lol?

Just because he can make a desert doens't mean Sasuke is allergic to sand or something. Kimi's CSL2 form showed how resistant he was to the sand. I think Sasuke's increased power will keep Gaara from giving him a 1 hit KO.

Spoiler:

You don't get it do you? Gaara can make his own desert, and then control the whole freakin' desert and there's no way Sasuke can avoid that. Did you not notice why we all love Kimimaro's ability? He couldn't be hurt by physical attacks. We can definitely not assume the same about Sasuke.

Neji can see almost everything but that's it.

I think he said he can also predict anything that goes on within his field of Hakke.

Edit: Tenten said he can sense all of his opponents attacks.

[MysticNinjaJay]

I hear alot of talking about Sasuke's 3 dot sharingan. Here are the basics of what I percieve its abilites are based on Sasuke's fight with Naruto. The complete sharingan (Which most elite Uchiha seem to have as does Kakashi) enables the user to have advanced anticipation of an opponents attacks. Its almost as good as seeing in the future because it predicts the opponents next move based on the subtle moevments of the body. However the faster you're opponent is the harder it is anticipate the move, also even if you already see the move coming if you're body isn't fast enough you'll still get hit. Thats why when he first used the move Sasuke dodged Naruto's preimage but the punch still nicked his face. If he couldn't predict the move Naruto would have just smashed his face in but thanks to the Sharingan he could just barely dodge the attack. As Naruto got faster Sasuke had more trouble doding attacks he could see in advance, so speed is still a factor. If he were up against an opponent like Gai I don't think he would he would have the reflexes to counter such immense taijustu. Against Kimimaro Sasuke should be able to dodge his long range and short range attacks however he may be overwhelmed by the dances, especially the dance of the seedling ferns which surrounds the battle field and can cause unblockable damage. Giant attacks like Gaara's Tsunami of Sand and the dance of the seedling ferns as will as the quick sand are the worst kind of jutsu because even with Sasuke's reflexes those moves are too hard to dodge. The 3 dot sharingan specializes in countering taijutsu but Sasuke is clearly not invincible. He can't master how to dodge attacks he doesn't know aren't coming he'd have to analyze a taijutsu style for a good while in order to master how to pick it apart. A rematch with Lee would be in Sasuke's favor as he knows his taijutsu front and back and now has the ability to dodge his movements with ease. He could do the same to Kimimaro but only after stuying his taijutsu the way Kakashi allowed him to do Lee's.

[DangerousOne]

Originally Posted by lotus_lee

And btw, to who ever made the comment about the CS2 and Lv3 Sharingan being of Hokage level, I doubt that is so. It's more like Jounin/Sannin level because even Orochimaru or Jiraiya can beat a CS2 and Lv3 Sharingan Sasuke. Also, the same with a Kyuubi berserk Naruto, he would probably only be Jounin/Sannin level as well. There's a LONG WAY before Sasuke and Naruto can be seen as really powerful. At the moment, they are just simply 'genius' Genin with a 'bit extra'. Many higher-Jounin (like Kakashi, Gai, Ebisu<---yes! even him!) would still beat them easily.

Finally, would people stop using silly 'if A>B and B>C, then A>C' logic? It never really does apply in the Naruto world.

First off Sannin lvl is Hokage lvl...as you know all the sannins have been considered for Hokage and 1 was turned down because of his attitude whilst the other rejected it. Oh yea, Ebisu would be killed by CS2 & Naruto. The little frog easily dealt with him..no way he can stand up to CS2 or Kyubi Naruto. We saw how normal Naruto luckily took down Kabuto, an Elite Jounin way above Ebisu..

[MysticNinjaJay]

All we know about Ebisu is that he is a great teacher. We have no clue what he can do combat wise and we probably aren't going to find out. He's a comic relief type character but if he trains potential Hokage candidates and uses jounin level moves like Kage Bunshin with extreme ease he must be good.

[Genei Killua]

I don't believe Sasuke's predicting abilities will help him as much in a fight with Neji as it did with Naruto mainly because of one reason--Naruto's fighting style is not only the easiest to predict, it's the easiest to dodge. Naruto was just launching himself at Sasuke from like forty feet away and flying past him when he dodged. Had it been a close-combat fight, with actual martial arts going on and not a street brawl, it would be harder for Sasuke to dodge punches mainly because the point of a lot of martial arts is strategic in getting the opponent into a certain point where he just can't dodge punches.

Also, as I mentioned before, close-combat is automatically a no for Sasuke, because he can't merely block Neji's attacks--that will get his shouko closed, which would spell an end to his chidori.

[UserName]

Originally Posted by Hunter

Just about that, since when Gaara's jutsus are "instant speed"?

Well you can't tell exact speed by manga. BUt 1 minute he's standing there the next panel his jutsu has already hit the opponent and they are utterly surprised.

Originally Posted by Hunter

Gaara started the fight against Kimi in a way which would have allowed Sasuke to have easily the edge given that he's way faster than Gaara's sand, if Sasuke used instantaneously his Chidori at close contact with his high speed Gaara could be beaten quickly. But let's be fair : that will never happen this way.
Gaara's abilities to create sand from the ground and to catch the opponent's legs is almost flawless, the only way to avoid that for Sasuke would be to remain at high speed constantly to avoid that Gaara would aim the sand at his position
But then remain the biggest threat, the desert avalanche.

Originally Posted by Hunter

Maybe Sasuke in CS lvl 2 could protect himself by surrounding his body with his wings as in a cocoon or simply a direct attack with the blackish Chidori directly through the wave of sand, kinda like Gunnm Last Order in the volume 4 for those who knows this extremely good series ^^

Won't he be taken down with the wave of sand if he directed the Chidori directly at it? Or Gaara can simply use his opening up the ground move and cause hiim to fall... unless he can fly.... But if he were to fly he would be very vunerable to the dessert avalanche.

Originally Posted by Hunter

No.
If the Sharingan can read through Taijutsu, it's not the case for the Byakugan.
As much as you like to repeat that, it doesn't change that it wasn't presented like a capacity of this bloodline.
Neji can see almost everything but that's it. It's not just because you can see that you can predict accordingly what the opponent will do next.

..... hmm..... A fighter with super vision would be able to read moves. Throwing the manga out, just say any manga. If someoen were to have super vision like that, he would be able to read moves fairly well.

Originally Posted by Hunter

It's true that Neji is able to avoid a Katon but this is where the full Sharingan would be extremely good.
Because Sasuke would see in advance how and where Neji will avoid his Katon and thus to attack him with kunai or else at the moments where Neji is the most vulnerable. With that Sasuke can easily force Neji to use and use the Kaiten way too often.

We have yet to see Neji tire from using the kaiten. He can also just pull out a kunai and knock away each and every shuriken.

Originally Posted by Hunter

Besides we saw Sasuke able to avoid every blows and beat without being even touched an opponent way faster than him.
If Sasuke doesn't have any problem to predict perfectly and avoid accordingly any attack from an opponent incredibly faster than him then he wouldn't have a problem to do that against an opponent slower than him.
The fact is that if Neji can't touch Sasuke then the awesome avantage given by the Jyuken is completely negated but for the Kaiten.

We've also seen Neji beat out an oponent way faster than him. Kyuubi Naruto. Sasuke can't predict perfectly as shown. If Neji can't touch Sasuke, Sasuke can't touch Neji. If sasuke were to be in the range of the hakke, he's done for. Unless Sasuke can sweat and cover himself in steel plated skin...

[lotus_lee]

Originally Posted by UserName

If Neji can't touch Sasuke, Sasuke can't touch Neji. If sasuke were to be in the range of the hakke, he's done for. Unless Sasuke can sweat and cover himself in steel plated skin...

Yea, I was under that impression as well. Even if Neji ain't as fast to catch up and hit Sasuke with his Jyuuken, he can still counter when he's hit directly by Sasuke by sending out chakra, like he did against Kidoumaru.

[Bflip]

Originally Posted by nh1

[spoiler]You don't get it do you? Gaara can make his own desert, and then control the whole freakin' desert

And an average American family can make serveral tons of trash, but it's not instantaneous, is it? Do you think it'll only take a couple seconds to do a tsunami of sand? Gaara was creating sand throughout his fight, and it will take at least a couple minutes to prepare. CSL2 Sasuke only needs a couple seconds to get past Gaara's defense and kill him right there. Nothing else Gaara can do because of Sasuke's increaesd speed.

And sand will have a rouch time keeping up with CSL2 Sasuke who flies if Rock Lee could dodge them so easily.

[MysticNinjaJay]

Originally Posted by Bflip

And an average American family can make serveral tons of trash, but it's not instantaneous, is it? Do you think it'll only take a couple seconds to do a tsunami of sand? Gaara was creating sand throughout his fight, and it will take at least a couple minutes to prepare. CSL2 Sasuke only needs a couple seconds to get past Gaara's defense and kill him right there. Nothing else Gaara can do because of Sasuke's increaesd speed.

And sand will have a rouch time keeping up with CSL2 Sasuke who flies if Rock Lee could dodge them so easily.

Regardless of how long it takes Gaara to create massive amounts of sand from the Earth (We really don't know he may have been able to do that the whole time) the calm, cool and collected Gaara that fought Kimimaro was very different from the unstable Gaara at the Chunin exam. Sasuke would be no match for him. Unless he could use Lee's taijutsu, zap to Gaara and use Chidori in an instant he wouldn't be able to land a hit on Gaara. We never saw him being capable of something like that against Naruto, he still had to take time to charge Chidori and either hit him head on or beat him until he could find an opening to hit a non moving target in Naruto. Gaara's sand is extremely lethal. He could make sand hands out of the ground and grab Sasuke's feet, then pull him under with quick sand and finally crush him under the weight of tons of sand that he can make as hard as rock. Sasuke would just die. Naruto probably would too unless he summoned Gamabunta and then we'd just have a rematch of last time.

[Hunter]

Originally Posted by nh1

I think he said he can also predict anything that goes on within his field of Hakke.

No nh1 that's not the first time UserName talks about this belief and his point is to say that because the Byakugan allows to see (almost) everything including little details blahblah then it can predict the moves of the opponents as well.
And even the prediction thingy just within his field of Hakke is no less than a wild guess.
It doesn't seem to be something else than the representation of the range of the field where Neji can carry an attack basically instantaneously.
That's an usual samurai stuff, I must be tired I can't remember how it's precisely named in japanese.

Edit: Tenten said he can sense all of his opponents attacks.

No it's just the translation, sense is correct but it has several meaning and is thus tendencious in english, Ten-Ten merely said that because Neji can see at almost 360° he can perceive all the attacks of his opponents around him.
Ie exactly what the Byakugan is known for.

Originally Posted by aptenergy

I know this has been argued before, but I don't think Sasuke can see that well.

That would mean that Sasuke vs. Kimimaro, Sasuke vs. Gai, Sasuke vs. Drunken Lee, and Sasuke vs. Neji would all be pointless battles (speaking of taijutsu stuff only). Anything involving taijutsu = no effect on a Sharingan user. I don't know about you, but that seems extremely, extremely overpowered.

No that doesn't mean that at all.
Sasuke would have had a hard time against Kimi because of the ability of Kimimaro to attack with his bones out of his body without speaking of his incredible resistance.
It's a kind of strike with no movements to begin with, just sudden attack coming out of nowhere and even if Sasuke was able to see it, it would have been too sudden and fast to be able to escape from it at this short distance.
It was the same problem with Naruto's chakra, even if Sasuke could see it at the last moment he couldn't avoid it.
Here the old sentence of Lee is applied.
Something that in the other hand the Byakugan could have done because it can see through the body and thus see the bones whereas they're still inside the body.

Gai is simply way better than Sasuke overall, actually I think the difference of speed would be just too much for Sasuke to handle.
I do think that there is no way for the poor Lee to beat Sasuke except by using the Gate and with luck.
It's just that Taijutsu alone isn't a smart option against a fully developped Sharingan except if you're incredibly faster.

The prediction ability of the Sharingan gives an important edge to its user but there are countless way to beat that : pure speed, pure overall strength, powerful jutsus and such.
What could do the prediction ability again a Taijutsu mixed with Ninjutsu like Dosu's attack?
Without knowing about it at first, a Sharingan user could avoid the blow yeah, and still he would be screwed because it's not enough.
Or the way of fighting of Kiba who used smoke bomb and then his improved nose to locate his opponent inside.
Something that the Byakugan wouldn't have a problem to deal with because it would see through the smoke contrary to the Sharingan which would lost his edge in this particular field.

discussion on my versus battles]I'm treating Gai as a ultra taijutsu master. Sure, Gai is extremely fast. But that if Sasuke can prepare for Gai's attacks, then speed won't matter at all - and from my understanding of the three-dot Sharingan, it tries to see [some time period] in advance, so AFAICT Sasuke would be able to read Gai's moves even better than he would read Lee's.

If Gai is too fast, Sasuke will not even see him despite his Sharingan.
During his fight against Naruto, he said that he couldn't catch Naruto's movements before he gained the full Sharingan.
Naruto was just so fast that he couldn't see him properly.
As Kakashi said that he couldn't catch Itachi's hand seals and as Sasuke started to be able to see Haku's attack while his Sharingan was awakening.

You can't predict what you can't see.

What I do think is that Sharingan combines two things: it sees where an attack will land based on their physical movements, and it gives the user the experience that a normal taijutsu user would have in analyzing someone's technique.

That slants a fight in Sasuke's favor, but it does not guarantee him 100% victory.

There is no doubt in my mind that a three dot Sharingan would give you a very impressive edge over the competition. But Sasuke vs. Naruto is not a comprehensive example - Naruto always uses very very simple taijutsu.

The fact that Naruto's skill in Taijutsu isn't so good (not to say he sucks ) doesn't change that for example Sasuke predicted that Naruto was going to pass behind him and from which side whereas he was still in front of him and that Naruto was however way faster than him.
Neji's moves are sharper, he knows how to use his body the best to fight at close combat but that doesn't change a bit to the fact that Sasuke could predict his moves.

And indeed that doesn't guarantee him a 100% victory, nothing can give that.
Like I say a match Sasuke vs. Neji would be awesome to see.

Neji would be overwhelmed by a Sasuke level 2. But I don't think any of the Konoha 5 would have been able to take Kidoumaru other than him, so that's a testament to Neji's skill. IMO Neji would have no issues defeating a Sasuke level 1.

Except maybe for a Kyubized Naruto with enough pure raw strengh to break the Kidoumaru's web I agree with you, but it's more a testament to Neji's particular ability against Kidoumaru's particular ability than about overall strength.
Fighting Kidoumaru without the Jyuken would be a pain in the ass for most people.

[MiniSilverTiger]

these posts are getting weird
in the battle between Neji and Sasuke, you can't really tell who would win.
Neji's techniques are good, but only in close range, and his eyes have a range too
if anyone is outside of that, that person can just throw stuff to waste Neji's chakra till he runs out(that person probably need a lot of patience)
and Neji isn't that fast
also, you really don't know what sasuke's abilities are in level 2, all we saw was the chidori and the wings(maybe he can fly or something or get two extra ands(those things looked like claws))
oh well
i'm bored
yay

[nh1]

Originally Posted by Hunter

No it's just the translation, sense is correct but it has several meaning and is thus tendencious in english, Ten-Ten merely said that because Neji can see at almost 360° he can perceive all the attacks of his opponents around him.
Ie exactly what the Byakugan is known for.

Sense and perceive is the same, but I get your point. It's not the same to predict.

[MysticNinjaJay]

Byakugan probably has the capacity to anticipate attacks in the same way as Sharingan, but until we see this portrayed in the exact same way in the manga we can only assume that Neji can anticipate attacks only as well as any other skilled ninja with quick reflexes. Even if he can't read movements the same way as Sasuke's sharingan his insight is incredible. I was impressed with the way he understood so much about his opponent Kidoumaru by being able to see through his techniques and understand how to defend against them. Byakugan gives you so many advantages in battle and sees things sharingan might never see coming. For instance there may be chakra build up in an opponent's body that a Byakugan user would realize is about to be used for a projectile attack. Byakugan would allow you to see an attack like Katon coming out you even while its forming. Sharingan might never see that attck coming until its to late and may allow you to just barely dodge the move. I really do hope we see more out of Neji in the future. He is being trained by his uncle and will probably be allowed to learn indepth secrets of the Hyuuga bloodline. I know none of the supporting cast are going to have as much character development as Sasuke or Naruto but they better grow stronger as ninja to keep things interesting. Thats what I like about the show as far as combat goes. You win some you lose some, and then you get stronger and learn more innovative techniques.

[Hunter]

Originally Posted by UserName

Well you can't tell exact speed by manga. BUt 1 minute he's standing there the next panel his jutsu has already hit the opponent and they are utterly surprised.

I don't really see which one you talk about, the regular sand attack do have speed, and he standed during two page for the desert avalanche.
The problem wasn't really that this jutsu is instantenous but that it's so large that it's almost impossible to escape from it.

Instant jutsus would be how the bones come out of Kimi's body, how the aura of chakra of Naruto reacted on its own or the Tsukiyomi for example.
The effect happens at the very moment the jutsu is used.

Won't he be taken down with the wave of sand if he directed the Chidori directly at it? Or Gaara can simply use his opening up the ground move and cause hiim to fall... unless he can fly.... But if he were to fly he would be very vunerable to the dessert avalanche.

Indeed, I was using not-so-probable examples (well the wings thingy isn't so far stretched I guess... ) to show that it wasn't completely impossible but like I said I think that Sasuke would lose this one.

..... hmm..... A fighter with super vision would be able to read moves. Throwing the manga out, just say any manga. If someoen were to have super vision like that, he would be able to read moves fairly well.

Firstly i would certainely not throw out the manga to explain an ability only existing in this manga but anyway it's wrong.
That's not because you have an excelent insight allowing you to see at nearly 360° that you can predict moves, heck or anyone would be able to predict the move in their smaller vision field.
And simply that was never presented as a capacity of the Byakugan, that's like saying that te Sharingan can see at almost 360°.

We have yet to see Neji tire from using the kaiten. He can also just pull out a kunai and knock away each and every shuriken.

The Kaiten use a large amount of chakra it's stated in the manga, it's why the chakra becomes visible like that to begin with.
And Neji can knock away a shurinken from almost anywhere thanks to the Byakugan, that's very true.
But not in every situation, especially if the shuriken/kunai/wire wasn't aiming at him in the first place but at the place Neji will be.
On a side note I would say that I don't really see how Neji could avoid a Huge Katon like the one that Sasuke used on the roof of the hospital except with the Kaiten.

We've also seen Neji beat out an oponent way faster than him. Kyuubi Naruto. Sasuke can't predict perfectly as shown. If Neji can't touch Sasuke, Sasuke can't touch Neji. If sasuke were to be in the range of the hakke, he's done for. Unless Sasuke can sweat and cover himself in steel plated skin...

Come on, Naruto wasn't so much faster than Neji when he fought him in the arena, against Sasuke who's however almost as fast as Lee, he was so fast that Sasuke was struck from everywhere without being even able to react at all.
Actually Neji was in trouble to fight the Kyubized Naruto even in close combat in the arena whereas Sasuke beat the hell out of a way more Kyubized Naruto without sweating or using any jutsu but his Sharingan.

If Neji is able to see everything that Sasuke will do (I don't believe that Sasuke's is able to find out the little blind spot of the Byakugan or to use this fact for that matters), Sasuke can see everything Neji will do even before it happens.
Neji may be better in Taijutsu skill but it lost most of its importance if the opponent can see where the blows will land in advance and has the speed to avoid them.
Which is the case for Sasuke.

[missing_nin]

Assuming that sasukes faster than neji (well, he is obviously not slower), i think a fully-developed sharingan is the little but decisive advantage for sasuke. And i want to refer to sasukes fight with oro. Sasuke didnt have a 3dot sharingan but he could predict and dodge oro who was moving pretty Fast

[wb_hicks]

Originally Posted by missing_nin

Assuming that sasukes faster than neji (well, he is obviously not slower), i think a fully-developed sharingan is the little but decisive advantage for sasuke. And i want to refer to sasukes fight with oro. Sasuke didnt have a 3dot sharingan but he could predict and dodge oro who was moving pretty Fast

in that fight it was only noted that sasuke was able to see oro, and he wasnt moving faster then his body could react too

[UserName]

[QUOTE=Hunter]I don't really see which one you talk about, the regular sand attack do have speed, and he standed during two page for the desert avalanche.
The problem wasn't really that this jutsu is instantenous but that it's so large that it's almost impossible to escape from it.[QUOTE=Hunter]
... Of course they have speed. I'm talking about the sand attacks in general. The ones like simply grabbing an opponent, he did it to Lee without moving his hands while Lee was in a sprint, he also did it to Kimi, both of them caught of gaurd the one he did to kimi was followed up by a desert coffin.

Originally Posted by Hunter

Instant jutsus would be how the bones come out of Kimi's body, how the aura of chakra of Naruto reacted on its own or the Tsukiyomi for example.
The effect happens at the very moment the jutsu is used.

As how Gaara sent the sand between Lee and Kimi a few times or how he caught a hold of them.

Originally Posted by Hunter

Firstly i would certainely not throw out the manga to explain an ability only existing in this manga but anyway it's wrong.
That's not because you have an excelent insight allowing you to see at nearly 360° that you can predict moves, heck or anyone would be able to predict the move in their smaller vision field.
And simply that was never presented as a capacity of the Byakugan, that's like saying that te Sharingan can see at almost 360°.

You don't seem to understand what I'm saying... Look. If you have good vision and notice things such as the starting of the hand, you will be able to predict where it is going and at what power depending on the quality of your vision. Simple by seeing it starting ot move. Just like if someone is oitning a gun at you and he pulls the trigger you can tell where it's going and when it's going to start, if you see him move his fingers back a tiny bit you may be able to tell that he's not going to do it. Basically reading the opponnent. What does the shairngna have to do with this? They both predict moves is what I said in relation to the 2. We've seen Hinata see something as it was right in front of her that a normal person won't notice. We've also seen Neji easily reading HInata by noticing slight changes. (well i won't call it slight but you get what I mean...)

Originally Posted by Hunter

The Kaiten use a large amount of chakra it's stated in the manga, it's why the chakra becomes visible like that to begin with.

Then Neji must have a huge amount of chakra. Or as I believe, he's very efficient with his chakra useage so he will be able to use it for a long time. I never siad anything about the kaiten's chakra bieng small, rather that he can use it for a long time.

Originally Posted by Hunter

And Neji can knock away a shurinken from almost anywhere thanks to the Byakugan, that's very true.
But not in every situation, especially if the shuriken/kunai/wire wasn't aiming at him in the first place but at the place Neji will be.

If he sees a shuriken coming at him, he should be able to knock it away.

asuke used on the roof of the hospital except with the Kaiten.

Originally Posted by Hunter

Come on, Naruto wasn't so much faster than Neji when he fought him in the arena, against Sasuke who's however almost as fast as Lee, he was so fast that Sasuke was struck from everywhere without being even able to react at all.
Actually Neji was in trouble to fight the Kyubized Naruto even in close combat in the arena whereas Sasuke beat the hell out of a way more Kyubized Naruto without sweating or using any jutsu but his Sharingan.

And having the affects of the curse seal.

Originally Posted by Hunter

If Neji is able to see everything that Sasuke will do (I don't believe that Sasuke's is able to find out the little blind spot of the Byakugan or to use this fact for that matters), Sasuke can see everything Neji will do even before it happens.
Neji may be better in Taijutsu skill but it lost most of its importance if the opponent can see where the blows will land in advance and has the speed to avoid them.
Which is the case for Sasuke.

If that's the case in avoiding. Then he will be avoiding till he tires out. But then if he gets in close combat, there's the hakke to worry about which is unavoidable still and it is known as the unavoidable move.

[tetra]

Sasuke hasn't seen the byakugan in action, ever. That gives Neji the advantage in case Sasuke ever decides to take a hit to be more offensive.
And also why can't Neji learn long range jutsus?