Shin High School DxD Volume 3 Discussion

[Hakai]

You get Maou-class power, you get Maou-class power. Everyone gets Maou-class powers.

Seriously though, it's the final arc. We'll probably see a lot of them(team DxD members) having Maou-class feats eventually, especially the ones closely related to Ise.

[Lucidrago]

Originally Posted by XFire

Yeah, that was Solid Impact, my bad.

Doesn't actually matter though, because Issei did use his Blasters on Grendel, who tanked them.

Grendel was vaped by extinguish star.

Strada overpowered Extinquish Star.

Xeonvia overpowered Strada.

Ergo Xenovia >>> Crimson Blaster attack.

I don't remember Issei ever using Crimson Blaster on Grendel. He fought Grendel in Volume 14 in CCQ. And he used a boosted Ascalon on Grendel if I recall correctly and Grendel took it.

Issei didn't use CCQ against Grendel in Volume 16 as he was saving it for Crom Cruach. So he couldn't have used Crimson Blaster.

In Volume 17, Issei(CCQ) and Sairaorg(BxB) fought Grendel. I don't remember him using Crimson Blaster in that battle either.

Xenovia exhausted Strada because he was tired fighting Arthur. He was an 87 year-old man who was far from his prime strength fighting with a replica Durandal that only had a fifth of the power of the original. And had just cut Extinguish Star in half and had taken on the possessor of the strongest holy sword before then. And he still deflected Xenovia's CrossxCrisis.

Xenovia fought prime Strada along with Irina in Shin Volume 2. And Ouryuu joined in later. Xenovia's CrossxCrisis along with Irina's and Ouryuu's attacks were able to overpower Strada and destroy his Durandal ll. And that still didn't finish him off.

There's no evidence that Xenovia is Maou-class or that her destructive power is on par with CCQ Issei.

[TheWu8128]

Originally Posted by Lucidrago

I don't remember Issei ever using Crimson Blaster on Grendel. He fought Grendel in Volume 14 in CCQ. And he used a boosted Ascalon on Grendel if I recall correctly and Grendel took it.

Issei didn't use CCQ against Grendel in Volume 16 as he was saving it for Crom Cruach. So he couldn't have used Crimson Blaster.

In Volume 17, Issei(CCQ) and Sairaorg(BxB) fought Grendel. I don't remember him using Crimson Blaster in that battle either.

Xenovia exhausted Strada because he was tired fighting Arthur. He was an 87 year-old man who was far from his prime strength fighting with a replica Durandal that only had a fifth of the power of the original. And had just cut Extinguish Star in half and had taken on the possessor of the strongest holy sword before then. And he still deflected Xenovia's CrossxCrisis.

Xenovia fought prime Strada along with Irina in Shin Volume 2. And Ouryuu joined in later. Xenovia's CrossxCrisis along with Irina's and Ouryuu's attacks were able to overpower Strada and destroy his Durandal ll. And that still didn't finish him off.

There's no evidence that Xenovia is Maou-class or that her destructive power is on par with CCQ Issei.

He got hit with it in volume 17 Sairaorg throw him in the air and Issei blasted him with the Crimson Blaster that how they defeated him. There you get one free one I just happened to have just reread that volume so, your welcome

[godz]

Originally Posted by Parry999

Xenovia fights prime Strada in Shin 2 anyway and he trash Grendel.


https://youtu.be/IGXYzNm29bQ she has the talent to be ultimate-class but with training she should be maou-class every other talented devil in the series was maou class at birth minus Vali xD

Originally Posted by Hakai

You get Maou-class power, you get Maou-class power. Everyone gets Maou-class powers.

Seriously though, it's the final arc. We'll probably see a lot of them(team DxD members) having Maou-class feats eventually, especially the ones closely related to Ise.

This reminds me of the super sayayin, a legendary power that everyone now has ... With the current levels of dxd I can no longer mock that freezer passed super sayayin level to super sayayin blue in 4 months or ichigo that equals a captain In only 3 months.

[Rayzer]

Originally Posted by XFire

@rayzer

Which means he wasn't tired out when he clashed with Xenovia. And she didn't have help when they clashed attacks at the end, when she overpowered him.

That's because he put all his remaining power into a single attack in his final clash with Xenovia. By the way, she didn't overpower him. He just fell on one knee due to exhaustion because of his age.

[XFire]

Originally Posted by Lucidrago

I don't remember Issei ever using Crimson Blaster on Grendel. He fought Grendel in Volume 14 in CCQ. And he used a boosted Ascalon on Grendel if I recall correctly and Grendel took it.

Issei didn't use CCQ against Grendel in Volume 16 as he was saving it for Crom Cruach. So he couldn't have used Crimson Blaster.

In Volume 17, Issei(CCQ) and Sairaorg(BxB) fought Grendel. I don't remember him using Crimson Blaster in that battle either.

Issei uses Crimson Blaster on Grendel in the fight together with Sairong. It's used to knock Grendel out of the air to set him up for Sairongs punch. Obviously it doesnt vaporize everything but his head like ES did.

Originally Posted by Lucidrago

Xenovia exhausted Strada because he was tired fighting Arthur. He was an 87 year-old man who was far from his prime strength fighting with a replica Durandal that only had a fifth of the power of the original. And had just cut Extinguish Star in half and had taken on the possessor of the strongest holy sword before then. And he still deflected Xenovia's CrossxCrisis.

Strada wasn't tired. Arthur ended the battle before either of them went all out. There was no indication of any form of tiredness effecting his performance.

87-year old Strada is the one who sliced through Extinquish Star, the attack that vaporized Grendel. Which is, as stated before, significantly more powerful the CxC Crimson Blaster.

Xenovia's Cross Crisis overpowered Strada completely and exhausted all of his strength.

Originally Posted by Lucidrago

Xenovia fought prime Strada along with Irina in Shin Volume 2. And Ouryuu joined in later. Xenovia's CrossxCrisis along with Irina's and Ouryuu's attacks were able to overpower Strada and destroy his Durandal ll. And that still didn't finish him off.

There's no evidence that Xenovia is Maou-class or that her destructive power is on par with CCQ Issei.

Prime Strada is the "you need to be a Heavenly Dragon class to fight me" Strada. Overpowering him at all is a God-class feat for their combined power.

Cross Crisis >>> Extinquish Star >>> Crimson Blaster. It's not a difficult concept.

Originally Posted by Rayzer

That's because he put all his remaining power into a single attack in his final clash with Xenovia. By the way, she didn't overpower him. He just fell on one knee due to exhaustion because of his age.

So the guy who sliced through ES burned up all his power failing to stop Cross Crisis. That would be overpowering him.

And you keep bringing up his age. You know his prime self is God-class, right?

[Lucidrago]

Originally Posted by TheWu8128

He got hit with it in volume 17 Sairaorg throw him in the air and Issei blasted him with the Crimson Blaster that how they defeated him. There you get one free one I just happened to have just reread that volume so, your welcome

Thanks. I couldn't remember whether he used Crimson Blaster on Grendel or not. I just knew he couldn't have used it on him in Volume 16 due to being in Balance Breaker when fighting Grendel in that volume.

[Rayzer]

Originally Posted by XFire

Issei uses Crimson Blaster on Grendel in the fight together with Sairong. It's used to knock Grendel out of the air to set him up for Sairongs punch. Obviously it doesnt vaporize everything but his head like ES did.



Strada wasn't tired. Arthur ended the battle before either of them went all out. There was no indication of any form of tiredness effecting his performance.

87-year old Strada is the one who sliced through Extinquish Star, the attack that vaporized Grendel. Which is, as stated before, significantly more powerful the CxC Crimson Blaster.

Xenovia's Cross Crisis overpowered Strada completely and exhausted all of his strength.



Prime Strada is the "you need to be a Heavenly Dragon class to fight me" Strada. Overpowering him at all is a God-class feat for their combined power.

Cross Crisis >>> Extinquish Star >>> Crimson Blaster. It's not a difficult concept.



So the guy who sliced through ES burned up all his power failing to stop Cross Crisis. That would be overpowering him.

And you keep bringing up his age. You know his prime self is God-class, right?

Dude you talk as if cutting Extinguished Star in half was easy when it wasn't. Strada had to exert a lot of power to cut it to the point where he was breathing hard.

[When we opened our eyes, the first thing which we saw was — the scene of Rias’s Extinguish Star sliced apart!

“—Ah.”

Rias was speechless at the sight of this. This was only to be expected. Even against an evil dragon, it was completely defenceless against this technique. Yet an old man, a human, was able to destroy it using the replica of a holy sword. We were also quite shocked by this. Strada’s shoulders were heaving as he breathed…after all, it was true that he cut the Extinguish Star. Rias could only smile mirthlessly.

“…After this, I have no choice but to smile bitterly.”

As Strada adjusted his breathing]

[XFire]

Originally Posted by Rayzer

Dude you talk as if cutting Extinguished Star in half was easy when it wasn't. Strada had to exert a lot of power to cut it to the point where he was breathing hard.

[When we opened our eyes, the first thing which we saw was — the scene of Rias’s Extinguish Star sliced apart!

“—Ah.”

Rias was speechless at the sight of this. This was only to be expected. Even against an evil dragon, it was completely defenceless against this technique. Yet an old man, a human, was able to destroy it using the replica of a holy sword. We were also quite shocked by this. Strada’s shoulders were heaving as he breathed…after all, it was true that he cut the Extinguish Star. Rias could only smile mirthlessly.

“…After this, I have no choice but to smile bitterly.”

As Strada adjusted his breathing]

I didn't say it was easy, but he still did it with far less power than he burned trying to stop Cross Crisis.

[Rayzer]

Originally Posted by XFire

I didn't say it was easy, but he still did it with far less power than he burned trying to stop Cross Crisis.

Cross×Crisis is strong but not more powerful than ES because even if both attacks are Maou class, due to the nature of ES being Power of Destruction, it would be stronger. Xenovia couldn't even break through Nero's defense with Cross×Crisis and this was when she had Crimson Destruction Dragonar and yet Rias vaporized an evil dragon who had absurd defense.

[Parry999]

Originally Posted by godz

This reminds me of the super sayayin, a legendary power that everyone now has ... With the current levels of dxd I can no longer mock that freezer passed super sayayin level to super sayayin blue in 4 months or ichigo that equals a captain In only 3 months.

The gap between maou class and mid to high class everyone started at isn't actually as big as the freeza gap you mentioned at all. That be like Shalba coming back stronger then Balberith. Friendly reminder Zaraki killed a captain with zero training and scared a veteran one as a kid xD.

[Lucidrago]

@Xfire The problem is that you're trying to compare Crimson Blaster and Extinguish Star like they're attacks of the same nature which they are not.

Crimson Blaster is an aura attack that Issei charges and releases from his cannons.

Extinguish Star is a huge sphere of POD that Rias charges up and fires at her opponent that also draws the opponent to it.

Power of Destruction is able to 'erase' anything it touches. Crimson Blaster is just Issei's most powerful aura attack in his CCQ form. Grendel had only half a head left because the nature of POD reduced Grendel's body to nothingness.

You're saying Xenovia is Maou-class because she overpowered Strada in their initial bout. She forced him to a knee but overpowered is kind of stretching it in my view. He had to cut Extinguish Star in half which showed visible effort on his part and then had to fight Arthur and then fought Xenovia as an old man whose physical strength wasn't what it once was and was using a replica Durandal.

You're making it look like she took on Strada when he was at his absolute best which he wasn't in Volume 19.

I'm not seeing anything that proves that Xenovia is Maou-class or as strong as Issei in CCQ as you claim she is.

[Parry999]

Originally Posted by Lucidrago

I'm not seeing anything that proves that Xenovia is Maou-class or as strong as Issei in CCQ as you claim she is.

She technically is by being an equal to Kiba in the story.

[B214]

Even Kiba couldn’t estimate the true strength of these two swordsmen, and bit his lip with a reluctant look. I’m afraid that he saw that his own strength was incomparable to those two, and at the same time because he understood the strength of those two, he could only grit his teeth. …Me too, my friend. …In this world, why are there such strong guys…. Moreover, he has the body of a human. The Vali team’s swordsman Arthur Pendragon, the wielder of the Holy King Sword. He is strong indeed…! The two swordsmen continued their breath-taking battle for a few minutes — but it suddenly came to an end. Both people exchanged a heavy blow with each other, and they jumped backwards before the sparks had disappeared. Both of them readjusted their sword stance…however, Arthur suddenly put his sword down. He adjusted his glasses, and smiled as he said

“…Wonderful — but, let’s stop. If this continues, I won’t be able to get over the shock.”

Arthur said a string of strange words, but Strada seemed to understand, and he also put down his sword for now.

“…Sorry, young swordsman.”

The old warrior began to smile wryly, indicating that he understood Arthur’s behaviour. Arthur smiled, then turned around to leave. When he came past our side, he only said one thing

“…If we met thirty years earlier, no, twenty years, it would certainly be the best battle. If it continued…it would only invite sadness.”

Well seeing from Arthur and Strada's brief exchange, Strada was indeed getting tired.

[godz]

Originally Posted by Parry999

The gap between maou class and mid to high class everyone started at isn't actually as big as the freeza gap you mentioned at all. That be like Shalba coming back stronger then Balberith. Friendly reminder Zaraki killed a captain with zero training and scared a veteran one as a kid xD.

My point was that the Maou class is like the super sayayin, a legendary power that everyone reaches now ... In other words dxd is falling into the same error or balance of dragonball power.

Pd: zaraki was always broken

[XFire]

Originally Posted by Rayzer

Cross×Crisis is strong but not more powerful than ES because even if both attacks are Maou class, due to the nature of ES being Power of Destruction, it would be stronger. Xenovia couldn't even break through Nero's defense with Cross×Crisis and this was when she had Crimson Destruction Dragonar and yet Rias vaporized an evil dragon who had absurd defense.

Except that both attacks met the same defense (well, offense) in Strada, and Cross Crisis did better.

Originally Posted by Lucidrago

@Xfire The problem is that you're trying to compare Crimson Blaster and Extinguish Star like they're attacks of the same nature which they are not.

Crimson Blaster is an aura attack that Issei charges and releases from his cannons.

Extinguish Star is a huge sphere of POD that Rias charges up and fires at her opponent that also draws the opponent to it.

Power of Destruction is able to 'erase' anything it touches. Crimson Blaster is just Issei's most powerful aura attack in his CCQ form. Grendel had only half a head left because the nature of POD reduced Grendel's body to nothingness.

This statement doesn't make any sense at all. ES' nature is part of the attack. The attacks are released at a target and do damage. How they do damage does not matter to the end result of the actual damage done.

When Issei fired his blasters at Grendel, he did x damage. When Rias fired ES at Grendel, it did y damage. Y >>>>>>x, in this case. There was no special interaction between attack and target. Grendel was not particularly vulnerable nor resistant to either move. Ergo when released against a different neutral target ES would deal more damage.

If Issei fired his blasters at Strada, Strada could cut down the blast, because he cut down the more powerful ES. He failed to cut down Cross Crisis despite exerting all the strength he had left, to the point the clash was cracking Issei's CxC armor through the ambient energy from the clash.

Originally Posted by Lucidrago

You're saying Xenovia is Maou-class because she overpowered Strada in their initial bout. She forced him to a knee but overpowered is kind of stretching it in my view. He had to cut Extinguish Star in half which showed visible effort on his part and then had to fight Arthur and then fought Xenovia as an old man whose physical strength wasn't what it once was and was using a replica Durandal.

You're making it look like she took on Strada when he was at his absolute best which he wasn't in Volume 19.

I'm not seeing anything that proves that Xenovia is Maou-class or as strong as Issei in CCQ as you claim she is.

The only one making a direct comparison between Xenovia and Strada is you, and it's an attempt to deflect that borders on disingenuous.

My statement is that Xenovia has Maou class firepower because her Cross Crisis is superior to Issei's blasters.

This is easily observed when using Extinguish Star as a measuring stick. When released against the same target, the blasters did worse than ES. When Cross Crisis was released against the same target, it did significantly better.

Originally Posted by B214

Well seeing from Arthur and Strada's brief exchange, Strada was indeed getting tired.

There's nothing in there that says he's tired, though? The two fighters could tell from their exchange how it would end, so the "winner" broke it off. Strada isn't even breathing hard.

[Rayzer]

Originally Posted by XFire

Except that both attacks met the same defense (well, offense) in Strada, and Cross Crisis did better.



This statement doesn't make any sense at all. ES' nature is part of the attack. The attacks are released at a target and do damage. How they do damage does not matter to the end result of the actual damage done.

When Issei fired his blasters at Grendel, he did x damage. When Rias fired ES at Grendel, it did y damage. Y >>>>>>x, in this case. There was no special interaction between attack and target. Grendel was not particularly vulnerable nor resistant to either move. Ergo when released against a different neutral target ES would deal more damage.

If Issei fired his blasters at Strada, Strada could cut down the blast, because he cut down the more powerful ES. He failed to cut down Cross Crisis despite exerting all the strength he had left, to the point the clash was cracking Issei's CxC armor through the ambient energy from the clash.



The only one making a direct comparison between Xenovia and Strada is you, and it's an attempt to deflect that borders on disingenuous.

My statement is that Xenovia has Maou class firepower because her Cross Crisis is superior to Issei's blasters.

This is easily observed when using Extinguish Star as a measuring stick. When released against the same target, the blasters did worse than ES. When Cross Crisis was released against the same target, it did significantly better.



There's nothing in there that says he's tired, though? The two fighters could tell from their exchange how it would end, so the "winner" broke it off. Strada isn't even breathing hard.

That doesn't make sense.

Strada wasn't trying to cut down Cross×Crisis. His aim was to deflect it and it did happen. He couldn't deflect an attack like Extinguished Star because it's basically like a mini black hole so he had to cut it down.

[XFire]

Originally Posted by Rayzer

That doesn't make sense.

Strada wasn't trying to cut down Cross×Crisis. His aim was to deflect it and it did happen. He couldn't deflect an attack like Extinguished Star because it's basically like a mini black hole so he had to cut it down.

Cross Crisis is a giant mass of aura fired from a sword. Of course he can cut it down. He was smashing everything that was coming at him that he could get his hand on, why would the sword laser be any different.

[Rayzer]

Originally Posted by XFire

Cross Crisis is a giant mass of aura fired from a sword. Of course he can cut it down. He was smashing everything that was coming at him that he could get his hand on, why would the sword laser be any different.

And yet Extinguished Star has shown better feats are vaporizing Grendel when Xenovia failed to beat Nero's defense. You're really think Cross×Crisis to be stronger than attack that was stated to be comparable to attacks from "True Form" Sirzech?

[godz]

I think they have deviated too much from the topic that is DxD Shin 3