Fate/stay night Heaven's Feel Movie Discussion Thread

[G147]

Well it'll be best if the remake anime covers the main issue of each route like, Saber in Fate, Archer in UBW and Sakura in HF.

[ukulelembo]

Originally Posted by Avatar of Dreams

...this single sentence being a "confirmation" of any sort. If you read the preceding sentence it's pretty clear to me that 本作 is not specifically referring to ufotable remake but Fate/Stay Night in general, of which Saber is a main heroine (but not that only one)...

Yes, this isn't any major confirmation, but once they acknowledged Saber as main heroine, then any different option for anime becomes improbable and counterproductive. Not mention that all current promotional images also gives biggest focus on Saber. Therefore Saber as main heroine is now practically inevitable even without any major confirmation. On the other hand there is still marginal chance for big surprise from Ufotable. But I would already don't give it high hopes.

Originally Posted by G147

Well it'll be best if the remake anime covers the main issue of each route like, Saber in Fate, Archer in UBW and Sakura in HF.

I believe that this is very possible and even currently more likely than normal adaptation of any route. The big question is whether Ufotable won't be afraid to do large divergences and changes from storylines of original routes. If they won't then I believe that we can expect presence of complete sub-plots from all routes. In that case as you say is likely that they use character storylines from individual routes. But also it's likely that familiar scenes appears in a different context or with a different outcome. I think that such a solution would probably be best and maintain tension even for people familiar with original visual novel.

[Cherry_Lover]

Originally Posted by ukulelembo

No, it's not. Actually it was predictable and inevitable. Saber is key character of whole franchize. There was no way to have her as something other than the main heroine.

That's simply untrue, though. There is already a Fate adaptation, we don't need another one.

If it is true then I'm not exactly shocked by the decision, no, Nasu has always seemed to pander to Saber fans at the expense of everyone else, but I'm still definitely disappointed. We already have a Fate adaptation, some originality would be nice.

On the other hand, you still don't need to worry. Even with Saber as main heroine this doesn't instantly mean that we get Fate route again.

I find it hard to see how it wouldn't at very least be based on Fate. It might have additional scenes and some changes, but I find it unlikely that they would go to the effort of re-writing the entire story from scratch to just do another Saber route.

Originally Posted by G147

Well it'll be best if the remake anime covers the main issue of each route like, Saber in Fate, Archer in UBW and Sakura in HF.

Sure, but I'm not sure how you would do that in a reasonable manner. That's the real question, how much effort they want to put in and how good a job they can do of it.

Originally Posted by ukulelembo

Yes, this isn't any major confirmation, but once they acknowledged Saber as main heroine, then any different option for anime becomes improbable and counterproductive.

Not really, I don't think they ever denied it.

Not mention that all current promotional images also gives biggest focus on Saber. Therefore Saber as main heroine is now practically inevitable even without any major confirmation.

Well, this is true but I don't think it tells us anything we don't already know. Saber is focussed on because she is popular, that doesn't automatically mean they intend to do her route (although it does make a direct HF adaptation unlikely).

On the other hand there is still marginal chance for big surprise from Ufotable. But I would already don't give it high hopes.

Yeah....

It wouldn't be a massive shock if they just did Fate again, because they just want to pander to bloody Saber fans, but it would still be really disappointing.

I believe that this is very possible and even currently more likely than normal adaptation of any route.

Well, I agree that something like this seems likely. It's clearly not going to just follow HF, but I think that doing something that was pretty much a pure Fate adaptation would be a bad move on their part, for two reasons. Firstly, anime fans will probably have seen the Fate adaptation already, so they will know the plot, and secondly a Fate adaptation will not cover a large part of the plot of Zero, which will annoy and confuse Zero-watchers who haven't seen the original anime.

The big question is whether Ufotable won't be afraid to do large divergences and changes from storylines of original routes. If they won't then I believe that we can expect presence of complete sub-plots from all routes. In that case as you say is likely that they use character storylines from individual routes.

Yeah, the question is what they can manage to come up with. Merging the three routes in any coherent manner without character derailing or some sort of Deus Ex Machina is difficult, particularly in the case of HF. Sakura doesn't turn Dark easily....

But also it's likely that familiar scenes appears in a different context or with a different outcome. I think that such a solution would probably be best and maintain tension even for people familiar with original visual novel.

Well, I'm not sure how you could do this, honestly, at least not without seriously pissing people off. You can't really change how Archer fights Shirou, for example, and having Sakura die would really rub in the general "sod you" attitude TM takes to Sakura fans.

[G147]

Originally Posted by Cherry_Lover

Sure, but I'm not sure how you would do that in a reasonable manner. That's the real question, how much effort they want to put in and how good a job they can do of it.

There are ways like maybe a battle between Shirou and Archer after Shirou loses his left hand to determine whether or not Shirou will abandon his dreams. Then Saber becomes Shirou's servant again after Shirou beats her and from Angra Mainyu. Well that's just my idea though.

[chaos_alfa]

Originally Posted by G147

There are ways like maybe a battle between Shirou and Archer after Shirou loses his left hand to determine whether or not Shirou will abandon his dreams. Then Saber becomes Shirou's servant again after Shirou beats her and from Angra Mainyu. Well that's just my idea though.

I like the tragic death ending of Saber in Heaven's Feel a lot. I hope they will keep it, but without knowing the development Saber went through in Fate and Unlimited Blade Works it probably won't be as effective.

[Cherry_Lover]

Originally Posted by chaos_alfa

I like the tragic death ending of Saber in Heaven's Feel a lot. I hope they will keep it, but without knowing the development Saber went through in Fate and Unlimited Blade Works it probably won't be as effective.

I'd be extremely surprised if they do, honestly. They're going to want to give Saber a happier conclusion than that.

[ukulelembo]

Originally Posted by Cherry_Lover

That's simply untrue, though.

What's untrue? That Saber is key character of whole franchize? Man, you mean this seriously?

Originally Posted by Cherry_Lover

There is already a Fate adaptation, we don't need another one.

Speak just for yourself. There are many people who will disagree with you.

Originally Posted by Cherry_Lover

If it is true then I'm not exactly shocked by the decision, no, Nasu has always seemed to pander to Saber fans at the expense of everyone else, but I'm still definitely disappointed. We already have a Fate adaptation, some originality would be nice.

This isn't just about Nasu.

Originally Posted by Cherry_Lover

Saber is focussed on because she is popular, that doesn't automatically mean they intend to do her route...

Yeah, it doesn't mean. But focus itself confirms her importance for story. Otherwise whole focus becomes stupid and counterproductive.

Originally Posted by Cherry_Lover

Yeah, the question is what they can manage to come up with. Merging the three routes in any coherent manner without character derailing or some sort of Deus Ex Machina is difficult.

As says one old screenwriting theorem: "As long as you respect the original work, you can do anything."

Originally Posted by Cherry_Lover

particularly in the case of HF. Sakura doesn't turn Dark easily....

I personally think that any scenes that come from HF, will be modified from original route probably most.

[Cherry_Lover]

Originally Posted by ukulelembo

What's untrue? That Saber is key character of whole franchize? Man, you mean this seriously?

That her being the most popular character means she has to be the focus. She's not the focus of Zero, for example, although she is definitely important.

I don't doubt that Saber will play a significant role in the story, but that doesn't mean she has to be the "main heroine". You're most likely right that she will be, but there is no reason why that has to be the case.

Speak just for yourself. There are many people who will disagree with you.

Perhaps, but frankly they should stop being so damn greedy.

Yeah, it doesn't mean. But focus itself confirms her importance for story. Otherwise whole focus becomes stupid and counterproductive.

Not really. It would hardly be the first time characters who are barely involved in a story were used to sell it due to their popularity.

As says one old screenwriting theorem: "As long as you respect the original work, you can do anything."

Sure, but that is easier said than done.

I personally think that any scenes that come from HF, will be modified from original route probably most.

Well, if the story follows a general Fate or UBW path then that seems likely, yes.

What I'm worried about, though, is that they'll do what Deen did, and attempt to take the dramatic scenes out of HF and shoehorn them into Fate without any of the context that makes them work. Even if they do a better job of shoehorning it in than Deen did (by not making the whole thing a throw-away arc that doesn't affect the overall story in any way aside from getting Caster killed-off), it still won't be particularly great if that is their approach.

[Brother Coa]

Guys, as I said: whoever is selected as Shirous love interest will be the main heroine. You can deny all you want but all 3 routes of F/SN are build over Shirou's selection of one of the three heroines and supporting them until the very end.

Beside, as I said like 10 times before, discussing about routes is futile as they will certainly not follow them. They said themselves that there will be new scenes witch means that they will not adapt original story-line like Fate/Zero but rather go with their own version of F/SN, with Nasu help now.

I think that the biggest question regarding this that are worthy of debate are:
-how they plan to deal with Zouken and Sakura part of the story if they decide not to follow HF route to the letter?
-will they present Avalon ending at the very end of anime?
-how will they deal with the rest of servants like Assassin, Caster etc...
-will they kill Shinji or let him live?
-will they kill Ilya like in UBW, let her sacrifice herself for Shirou like in HF or let her live at least a little as normal and happy human after Fate?
-how will they exactly rewrite Shirou's character to be more lovable by everyone?
etc....

Now this things... are worth of debate.

[GDB]

Originally Posted by Brother Coa

Beside, as I said like 10 times before, discussing about routes is futile as they will certainly not follow them. They said themselves that there will be new scenes witch means that they will not adapt original story-line like Fate/Zero but rather go with their own version of F/SN, with Nasu help now.

No, it means there will be new scenes. They can still easily follow a single route and add new scenes without taking anything from another route, because new scenes are just new scenes. There's no descriptive element that says new scenes have to be to transition from one route to another.

[Brother Coa]

Ok, why would they add a new scenes if they plan to follow an original route to the letter?

It is not logical. They would only do that if they plan to do a multiple routes storyline, because new scenes would be for integration between routes.

Anything other than that is pointless because it ruins the originality of the route storyline.

[GDB]

Originally Posted by Brother Coa

Ok, why would they add a new scenes if they plan to follow an original route to the letter?

Per their interviews, to add information that was not in the original that they want fans to know.

It is not logical. They would only do that if they plan to do a multiple routes storyline, because new scenes would be for integration between routes.

Anything other than that is pointless because it ruins the originality of the route storyline.

See above. It's for additional information, which is a perfectly logical thing to use new scenes for.

[chaos_alfa]

Originally Posted by Brother Coa

Ok, why would they add a new scenes if they plan to follow an original route to the letter?

It is not logical. They would only do that if they plan to do a multiple routes storyline, because new scenes would be for integration between routes.

Anything other than that is pointless because it ruins the originality of the route storyline.

Originally Posted by GDB

Per their interviews, to add information that was not in the original that they want fans to know.



See above. It's for additional information, which is a perfectly logical thing to use new scenes for.

Here is one source to back you up.

Originally Posted by http://www.siliconera.com/2014/01/28/new-fatestay-night-anime-serious-like-fatezero/

Nasu himself is present every time the scenario writers meet and provides a great deal of background information. ufotable are trying to incorporate as much of this information into the show as possible, a lot of which wasn’t included in the original.

This isn't the actual quote I was looking for. I remember to have read a translated part of the interview which stated it much more explicated that Nasu was revealing background information at the scenario writer meet ups which wasn't in the visual novel.

[Brother Coa]

That only proves that they will expand some scenes to let public better understand what is appending, that is not confirmation that they will animate only one route storyline.
To me it's a hint ( as well as the source posted above ) that they will do multiple routes instead of one and use extended and new scenes to fill the gap between them.

Also they confirmed that they will cahnge Shirou, that is pretty much confirmed that story-lien will change is some directions since this Shirou will act differently than the original one.

[GDB]

Originally Posted by Brother Coa

That only proves that they will expand some scenes to let public better understand what is appending, that is not confirmation that they will animate only one route storyline.

No one said it was. You, however, did say that the only way to use new scenes was to bridge routes together. The quote proves that to be incorrect.

To me it's a hint ( as well as the source posted above ) that they will do multiple routes instead of one and use extended and new scenes to fill the gap between them.

And that's just you reading what you want to read, as it says nothing of the sort.

Also they confirmed that they will cahnge Shirou, that is pretty much confirmed that story-lien will change is some directions since this Shirou will act differently than the original one.

Story line doesn't have to change to make Shirou appear less like an ass.

[cyberdemon]

Originally Posted by GDB

No one said it was. You, however, did say that the only way to use new scenes was to bridge routes together. The quote proves that to be incorrect.



And that's just you reading what you want to read, as it says nothing of the sort.



Story line doesn't have to change to make Shirou appear less like an ass.

agreed

additional scenes would be like, for example, expanding on Saber in the HF route to make her more developed. scenes that make her fate in it more satisfying for her.

I'd personally would love it if they did all 3 routes. That would certainly make this argument about which route redundant lol. it would really be the only way to fit everything without mishmashing things together like Deen. They would need, at minimum, 50 episodes to pull that off.

[Brother Coa]

Ok, I suppose we will have to wait until fall or at least some new trailer to see how it will go out. I am still convinced that they will do more than focus on just one route and add extra material to compensate for lack of other routes explanations ( Archer's identity, the true nature of the Grail etc... ).

And different Shiou act differently than the old ones, that means that he may do some things or make some decisions differently and thus different from the original story-line a little. We shall see.

They would need, at minimum, 50 episodes to pull that off.

Witch I doubt they will do, as much as I would love to for them go like Deathnote or Fullmetal Alchemist mixed with Yosuga no Sora ( the way how they covered al lthe routes ) they will probably go standard 25 episodes anime.

[blitz1/2]

Maybe they should just go with deleted materials and go Stray Servant route! xD

[Brother Coa]

Can't wait, I really hope for new footage this time instead of PS Vita footage.

[Brother Coa]

Unfotable just released this on their Twitter:



Can someone translate?