(L+CR) Fate/Grand Order: Zettai Majū Sensen Babylonia Anime General Discussion

[Thess]

Originally Posted by Kanon

I hadn't noticed Solomon was voiced by Sugita, what with his voice being modified and everything. His monologue was intriguing.

It's a dual voice (the softer VA underneath booming Sugita is a spoiler). Sugita is also voicing Lev and all the 72 demon gods. And is the narration of the guy who hates Solomon for his indifference is the same voice. They shouldn't have voiced this scene if they still wanted to make this misleading. It's too obvious now.

[Freya]

Still new to this series I guess. Fugimaru's character is pretty annoying to me. Dude is pretty useless.

[Frontier]

So the Big Bad is Solomon of all people? Seems to have a pretty myopic view of humanity and life itself from what we see of him .

Not surprising that it's the Spartan who's the training and muscle nut. Although past episodes have shown Ritsuka has a pretty healthy exercise routine .

Merlin and Ana's conversation was particularly interesting, expanding on what it is that draws inhuman beings who might not even truly have emotions to ally themselves with humanity and lengths of which someone might believe in someone else whether they're completely open about themselves or not...although for all of Merlin's talk about not having any emotions or caring about humans, I wonder what his reaction to Artoria's death was .

It was pretty awesome getting to see Ushiwakamaru, Benkei, and Leonidas all in action, especially Ushiwaka as she cuts through Demonic Beasts with her game-face on .

What better reason to fight then head pats ?

Nice to see Merlin finally get more involved and give Ana the boost she needed to really do some damage .

Fou finally really showing off why she's not something to be underestimated...although I wonder where the heck she transported herself and Ana off too ?

Solomon may be the overarching villain, but our heroes finally encounter the Goddess who is at the center of all the trouble in Uruk, Tiamat. And she is as gorgeous a beauty as she is deadly a monster...and yeah, hard not to notice the similarities with An and what an adult Rider/Medusa looked like .

So our heroes are going to take on Tiamat, though considering we're only barely into the 2-cour and the heroes could barely fight off Enkidu, I'm not expecting they'll make much of a dent on Tiamat .

[DragoMuseveni]

Quick question : Is Ritsuka going to summon any of his gacha servants or is he going to use only Mashu?

[Cosmic Eagle]

Originally Posted by DragoMuseveni

Quick question : Is Ritsuka going to summon any of his gacha servants or is he going to use only Mashu?

He'll use who you get in the story (ie, Mashu and any story supports)

[kagato3]

Originally Posted by Freya

Still new to this series I guess. Fugimaru's character is pretty annoying to me. Dude is pretty useless.

what exactly are you expecting Fugimaru to be? He's less trained in Mage craft than even Shirou was. He's been fighting against beings that severely out class him, in Babylon this is taken up to eleven as he is fighting gods during the age of gods. Due to the nature of the game he is something of a non-action man as his role is making the final calls on plans and being minor support and a cheering section. The only thing special about him is he has a 100% compatibility for being a master

[Random14]

Still a bit odd having relatively normal life stuff (help with the bricks) then facing down that huge goddess. Especially when "Enkidu" is already more powerful than most of them and now things are even worse. It was nice seeing how the normal soldiers fought the demonic beasts, Leonidas is perfect for a defensive situation like this.

They sure flashback to that moment from London a lot but then that was a big moment in the overall story, seeing the King of Mages for the first time. Though a lot of this does feel like its meant for players rather than for first time anime viewers (episode 0 even moreso), a lot of the hints won't mean anything unless you're aware of the whole story.

Originally Posted by DragoMuseveni

Quick question : Is Ritsuka going to summon any of his gacha servants or is he going to use only Mashu?

Almost definitely not. They'll just keep it to Mash and the "supports" for simplicity's sake. That and I think an earlier episode mentioned that rayshifting back so far in time is really hard, to justify why its the bare minimum with Ritsuka and Mash with no reinforcements.

I'm looking forward to an important battle next time, rather than them just fighting random monsters. Ushiwakamaru is on her way but not sure how Mash can hold off something like that (or rather, how they'll animate something like that, just that monster's "hair" dwarfs regular people already).

[Freya]

Originally Posted by kagato3

what exactly are you expecting Fugimaru to be? He's less trained in Mage craft than even Shirou was. He's been fighting against beings that severely out class him, in Babylon this is taken up to eleven as he is fighting gods during the age of gods. Due to the nature of the game he is something of a non-action man as his role is making the final calls on plans and being minor support and a cheering section. The only thing special about him is he has a 100% compatibility for being a master

Ah....just wish he did exactly that lol. A bit more than making calls and minor support but that's not to be.

[Thess]

Originally Posted by Random14

They sure flashback to that moment from London a lot but then that was a big moment in the overall story, seeing the King of Mages for the first time. Though a lot of this does feel like its meant for players rather than for first time anime viewers (episode 0 even moreso), a lot of the hints won't mean anything unless you're aware of the whole story.

I don't know about that. I won't hide this under a spoiler because is right in the episode. The narrator of the vision who complains about King Solomon's inaction is literally saying "build the band of light" (and it shows the inciniration band lighting up the sky). That's not even a subtle hidden clue at all.

Maybe they threw away subtlety because we've skipped a lot of the pieces of the puzzle with the previous singularities, but it honestly left me speechless. I was wondering if they would resort to text to present it and they not only use Sugita clearly as the narrator but also shows that vividly on screen.

[Kanon]

As an anime only watcher, I honestly have no idea what you guys are talking about.

[alex_drian]

Originally Posted by Kanon

As an anime only watcher, I honestly have no idea what you guys are talking about.

Where are you lost? the why of the overall story or the maboo jamboo of Solomon, because if is this last one, don't worry much about it because they seem to try to give a basic explanation of the situation and dig to much in the mechanics is only going to mess with you.

Also, fat snake is faaaaaaaaaaaaaat.

[Kanon]

Originally Posted by alex_drian

Where are you lost? the why of the overall story or the maboo jamboo of Solomon, because if is this last one, don't worry much about it because they seem to try to give a basic explanation of the situation and dig to much in the mechanics is only going to mess with you.

Also, fat snake is faaaaaaaaaaaaaat.

The Solomon scene, I didn't get what it was supposed to be spoiling. But I got a PM and I think I get it now.

[AC-Phoenix]

Originally Posted by Sheba

Babylonia. Lostroom is meant to be an introduction to the second arc of FGO, Cosmos in the Lostbelt, its target audience being the fgo players who cleared arc 1 and Epic of Remnant.

Yeah it still aired though, and gave people information. Unless we are still talking about two different episodes that is. (Cause I really can't remember it's name)

So just to be sure: We are talking about the one that showed how Fujjimaru became a master and Mash a servant and how Olga "died" where they went back to an alternate-servant class Fujuki Grail war?

I'll put the below theory into a spoiler tag in the meantime because said episode basically tells you who Ana is too

Spoiler for 'Tiamat' and 'Ana' Identity Theory:

If that is Tiamat I'll eat my hat.

Anyway let's start with Ana first.

So Ana imho is a younger version of FSN's Medusa. First off she is using really similar chain weapons, and then there is the scythe.

Now this scythe is pretty interesting since we have seen it before, namely in the alternate Fujuki Grail war mentioned above. On whom? Medusa (the even if you ignore the similar design, the stone garden made it obvious)

Guess what else we saw there? Chains again, and something similar to a scythe although I forgot what that weapon was called. So from those things you can already guess that Ana is in fact a young Medusa. Also there is a strange eye on her hood, although I have no idea what that's supposed to mean.


So now to "Tiamat.
First off, the goddess Tiamat is supposed to be either a Sea-Serpent or a Drgaon, what we see here on the other hand is more akin to a snake (Even Merlin said snake eyes). Whether Tiamat is actually called Mother of Monsters, no idea.

The only one I know under that title is the greek monster Echidna, which btw had several heads

Let's start with all them snakes, and the eye-based paralysis. At best she is Echidna, Mother of Monsters. That on the other hand though would make all the references made towards Ana really useless.
So how is Echidna supposed to look like?
basically a half-snake half human, sometimes depicted with snake hair. You know who else has snake hair, btw? Medusa.

So let's check on "Tiamat" now:
Eyes: Same as Medusa's (F/SN)
Hair: Snake hair
Lower Body: Snake
Hands: Clawed

Sounds more like Echidna than Tiamat, who is supposed to be a dragon tbh
So now, being the mother of Monsters' Echidna would also be the mother of the Gorgon sisters.

So now it is important to know, that the original Medusa didn't have a snake body. In classical Greek Mythology the Gorgons were described as immortal and rather Ugly, with one exception that is (Medusa) all of them had snake hair though. Sometimes it's also Athena turning them ugly.

So since we already know that in fateverse they are supposed to be goddesses, with Medusa having brought her change upon herself.
Why the backtrack to Medusa here? First off, in fateverse the Gorgons are apparently not monsters, hence can't be Echidna's children.
And here is the twist: The inclined connection between Tiamat and Ana/Medusa makes it impossible for her to be Echidna within that story?

So what remains if she is neither Tiamat or Echidna?
Well thanks to Hollywood, Medusa is often depicted as a half-snake too so we now got another option - Medusa again. And conveniently, "Tiamat" also has the same hair color as Medusa and Ana


So what fate shows us here is in my opinion basically a Medusa evolution story:

Medusa at the point she started to "hate" humans (since Merlin implied she doesn't) --> Medusa as seen in Fate/SN --> Medusa as seen in the FGO episode described outside the spoiler tag. This is probably around the time she started her stone garden. --> Self-Proclaimed Tiamat, Medusa around the time she ate Stheno and Euryale.

Either that or she is actually Echidna and I missed the part where the Fate Gorgons were still related to her.

So in my theory the evolution goes like this: Medusa(Ana)->Medusa(F/SN)->Medusa(FGO Episode) At this point she probably started the stone garden-> Medusa as seen in Babylon

Edit: Btw... Wait Fou has energy left?

[heroeric]

Originally Posted by AC-Phoenix

Yeah it still aired though, and gave people information. Unless we are still talking about two different episodes that is. (Cause I really can't remember it's name)

So just to be sure: We are talking about the one that showed how Fujjimaru became a master and Mash a servant and how Olga "died" where they went back to an alternate-servant class Fujuki Grail war?

I'll put the below theory into a spoiler tag in the meantime because said episode basically tells you who Ana is too

Spoiler for 'Tiamat' and 'Ana' Identity Theory:

If that is Tiamat I'll eat my hat.

Anyway let's start with Ana first.

So Ana imho is a younger version of FSN's Medusa. First off she is using really similar chain weapons, and then there is the scythe.

Now this scythe is pretty interesting since we have seen it before, namely in the alternate Fujuki Grail war mentioned above. On whom? Medusa (the even if you ignore the similar design, the stone garden made it obvious)

Guess what else we saw there? Chains again, and something similar to a scythe although I forgot what that weapon was called. So from those things you can already guess that Ana is in fact a young Medusa. Also there is a strange eye on her hood, although I have no idea what that's supposed to mean.


So now to "Tiamat.
First off, the goddess Tiamat is supposed to be either a Sea-Serpent or a Drgaon, what we see here on the other hand is more akin to a snake (Even Merlin said snake eyes). Whether Tiamat is actually called Mother of Monsters, no idea.

The only one I know under that title is the greek monster Echidna, which btw had several heads

Let's start with all them snakes, and the eye-based paralysis. At best she is Echidna, Mother of Monsters. That on the other hand though would make all the references made towards Ana really useless.
So how is Echidna supposed to look like?
basically a half-snake half human, sometimes depicted with snake hair. You know who else has snake hair, btw? Medusa.

So let's check on "Tiamat" now:
Eyes: Same as Medusa's (F/SN)
Hair: Snake hair
Lower Body: Snake
Hands: Clawed

Sounds more like Echidna than Tiamat, who is supposed to be a dragon tbh
So now, being the mother of Monsters' Echidna would also be the mother of the Gorgon sisters.

So now it is important to know, that the original Medusa didn't have a snake body. In classical Greek Mythology the Gorgons were described as immortal and rather Ugly, with one exception that is (Medusa) all of them had snake hair though. Sometimes it's also Athena turning them ugly.

So since we already know that in fateverse they are supposed to be goddesses, with Medusa having brought her change upon herself.
Why the backtrack to Medusa here? First off, in fateverse the Gorgons are apparently not monsters, hence can't be Echidna's children.
And here is the twist: The inclined connection between Tiamat and Ana/Medusa makes it impossible for her to be Echidna within that story?

So what remains if she is neither Tiamat or Echidna?
Well thanks to Hollywood, Medusa is often depicted as a half-snake too so we now got another option - Medusa again. And conveniently, "Tiamat" also has the same hair color as Medusa and Ana


So what fate shows us here is in my opinion basically a Medusa evolution story:

Medusa at the point she started to "hate" humans (since Merlin implied she doesn't) --> Medusa as seen in Fate/SN --> Medusa as seen in the FGO episode described outside the spoiler tag. This is probably around the time she started her stone garden. --> Self-Proclaimed Tiamat, Medusa around the time she ate Stheno and Euryale.

Either that or she is actually Echidna and I missed the part where the Fate Gorgons were still related to her.

So in my theory the evolution goes like this: Medusa(Ana)->Medusa(F/SN)->Medusa(FGO Episode) At this point she probably started the stone garden-> Medusa as seen in Babylon

Edit: Btw... Wait Fou has energy left?

The anime that covers the Fuyuki singularity is called Fate/Grand Order: First Order

[Thess]

Originally Posted by AC-Phoenix

So just to be sure: We are talking about the one that showed how Fujjimaru became a master and Mash a servant and how Olga "died" where they went back to an alternate-servant class Fujuki Grail war?

That's First Order which adapts the game prologue: Singularity F. Moonlight Lostroom is trippy that takes place before the prologue of part 2 Cosmos in the Lostbelts, believe me, you would be confused if you watched it. Also what's up with the "died"? Her body blew up in an explosion. She was dead before her spirit got rayshifted into Fuyuki.

Originally Posted by AC-Phoenix

Edit: Btw... Wait Fou has energy left?

Yes. It's not important

Spoiler for sorta spoilerly:

unless they adapt the last singularity. Anyway, I don't remember if this scene got skipped or will be in the future, but Ishtar freaks out when she notices him because she recognizes what/who he is. Most current don't know his real nature aside from Merlin and

Spoiler for spoiler within spoiler:

Dr. Roman.

Maybe "Ziusandra" knows as well.

[GDB]

Said scene got skipped, as it should have happened when she got tied up.

[alex_drian]

Originally Posted by AC-Phoenix

Yeah it still aired though, and gave people information. Unless we are still talking about two different episodes that is. (Cause I really can't remember it's name)

So just to be sure: We are talking about the one that showed how Fujjimaru became a master and Mash a servant and how Olga "died" where they went back to an alternate-servant class Fujuki Grail war?

I'll put the below theory into a spoiler tag in the meantime because said episode basically tells you who Ana is too

Spoiler for 'Tiamat' and 'Ana' Identity Theory:

If that is Tiamat I'll eat my hat.

Anyway let's start with Ana first.

So Ana imho is a younger version of FSN's Medusa. First off she is using really similar chain weapons, and then there is the scythe.

Now this scythe is pretty interesting since we have seen it before, namely in the alternate Fujuki Grail war mentioned above. On whom? Medusa (the even if you ignore the similar design, the stone garden made it obvious)

Guess what else we saw there? Chains again, and something similar to a scythe although I forgot what that weapon was called. So from those things you can already guess that Ana is in fact a young Medusa. Also there is a strange eye on her hood, although I have no idea what that's supposed to mean.


So now to "Tiamat.
First off, the goddess Tiamat is supposed to be either a Sea-Serpent or a Drgaon, what we see here on the other hand is more akin to a snake (Even Merlin said snake eyes). Whether Tiamat is actually called Mother of Monsters, no idea.

The only one I know under that title is the greek monster Echidna, which btw had several heads

Let's start with all them snakes, and the eye-based paralysis. At best she is Echidna, Mother of Monsters. That on the other hand though would make all the references made towards Ana really useless.
So how is Echidna supposed to look like?
basically a half-snake half human, sometimes depicted with snake hair. You know who else has snake hair, btw? Medusa.

So let's check on "Tiamat" now:
Eyes: Same as Medusa's (F/SN)
Hair: Snake hair
Lower Body: Snake
Hands: Clawed

Sounds more like Echidna than Tiamat, who is supposed to be a dragon tbh
So now, being the mother of Monsters' Echidna would also be the mother of the Gorgon sisters.

So now it is important to know, that the original Medusa didn't have a snake body. In classical Greek Mythology the Gorgons were described as immortal and rather Ugly, with one exception that is (Medusa) all of them had snake hair though. Sometimes it's also Athena turning them ugly.

So since we already know that in fateverse they are supposed to be goddesses, with Medusa having brought her change upon herself.
Why the backtrack to Medusa here? First off, in fateverse the Gorgons are apparently not monsters, hence can't be Echidna's children.
And here is the twist: The inclined connection between Tiamat and Ana/Medusa makes it impossible for her to be Echidna within that story?

So what remains if she is neither Tiamat or Echidna?
Well thanks to Hollywood, Medusa is often depicted as a half-snake too so we now got another option - Medusa again. And conveniently, "Tiamat" also has the same hair color as Medusa and Ana


So what fate shows us here is in my opinion basically a Medusa evolution story:

Medusa at the point she started to "hate" humans (since Merlin implied she doesn't) --> Medusa as seen in Fate/SN --> Medusa as seen in the FGO episode described outside the spoiler tag. This is probably around the time she started her stone garden. --> Self-Proclaimed Tiamat, Medusa around the time she ate Stheno and Euryale.

Either that or she is actually Echidna and I missed the part where the Fate Gorgons were still related to her.

So in my theory the evolution goes like this: Medusa(Ana)->Medusa(F/SN)->Medusa(FGO Episode) At this point she probably started the stone garden-> Medusa as seen in Babylon

What you are describing is First Order which adapts the game prologue: Singularity F, with Caster Cu and Saber Alter as the boss.

Moonlight Lostroom is a kind of introduction that takes place before the prologue of part 2 Cosmos in the Lostbelts. You know, that where a dead Olga is dreaming that she is SO good master that she can fend Gil and Ishtar with Emiya Alter and Mephisto, LOL. And with Galahad kung-fu-ing some Servant and being an asshole.

Btw, you miss one in your evolution theory: Full monster Gorgon that was slayed by Perseus.

[Thess]

Originally Posted by GDB

Said scene got skipped, as it should have happened when she got tied up.

Oh ok, I wasn't sure since it's been years and I mostly re-read parts that interest me.

[Tenzen12]

Originally Posted by AC-Phoenix

Yeah it still aired though, and gave people information. Unless we are still talking about two different episodes that is. (Cause I really can't remember it's name)

So just to be sure: We are talking about the one that showed how Fujjimaru became a master and Mash a servant and how Olga "died" where they went back to an alternate-servant class Fujuki Grail war?

I'll put the below theory into a spoiler tag in the meantime because said episode basically tells you who Ana is too

Spoiler for 'Tiamat' and 'Ana' Identity Theory:

If that is Tiamat I'll eat my hat.

Anyway let's start with Ana first.

So Ana imho is a younger version of FSN's Medusa. First off she is using really similar chain weapons, and then there is the scythe.

Now this scythe is pretty interesting since we have seen it before, namely in the alternate Fujuki Grail war mentioned above. On whom? Medusa (the even if you ignore the similar design, the stone garden made it obvious)

Guess what else we saw there? Chains again, and something similar to a scythe although I forgot what that weapon was called. So from those things you can already guess that Ana is in fact a young Medusa. Also there is a strange eye on her hood, although I have no idea what that's supposed to mean.


So now to "Tiamat.
First off, the goddess Tiamat is supposed to be either a Sea-Serpent or a Drgaon, what we see here on the other hand is more akin to a snake (Even Merlin said snake eyes). Whether Tiamat is actually called Mother of Monsters, no idea.

The only one I know under that title is the greek monster Echidna, which btw had several heads

Let's start with all them snakes, and the eye-based paralysis. At best she is Echidna, Mother of Monsters. That on the other hand though would make all the references made towards Ana really useless.
So how is Echidna supposed to look like?
basically a half-snake half human, sometimes depicted with snake hair. You know who else has snake hair, btw? Medusa.

So let's check on "Tiamat" now:
Eyes: Same as Medusa's (F/SN)
Hair: Snake hair
Lower Body: Snake
Hands: Clawed

Sounds more like Echidna than Tiamat, who is supposed to be a dragon tbh
So now, being the mother of Monsters' Echidna would also be the mother of the Gorgon sisters.

So now it is important to know, that the original Medusa didn't have a snake body. In classical Greek Mythology the Gorgons were described as immortal and rather Ugly, with one exception that is (Medusa) all of them had snake hair though. Sometimes it's also Athena turning them ugly.

So since we already know that in fateverse they are supposed to be goddesses, with Medusa having brought her change upon herself.
Why the backtrack to Medusa here? First off, in fateverse the Gorgons are apparently not monsters, hence can't be Echidna's children.
And here is the twist: The inclined connection between Tiamat and Ana/Medusa makes it impossible for her to be Echidna within that story?

So what remains if she is neither Tiamat or Echidna?
Well thanks to Hollywood, Medusa is often depicted as a half-snake too so we now got another option - Medusa again. And conveniently, "Tiamat" also has the same hair color as Medusa and Ana


So what fate shows us here is in my opinion basically a Medusa evolution story:

Medusa at the point she started to "hate" humans (since Merlin implied she doesn't) --> Medusa as seen in Fate/SN --> Medusa as seen in the FGO episode described outside the spoiler tag. This is probably around the time she started her stone garden. --> Self-Proclaimed Tiamat, Medusa around the time she ate Stheno and Euryale.

Either that or she is actually Echidna and I missed the part where the Fate Gorgons were still related to her.

So in my theory the evolution goes like this: Medusa(Ana)->Medusa(F/SN)->Medusa(FGO Episode) At this point she probably started the stone garden-> Medusa as seen in Babylon

Edit: Btw... Wait Fou has energy left?

You are overthinking. What we see is most likely both Tiamat and Medusa. In first place Tiamat has actually two atribut divine and that of monstrous embodiment primodeal chaos. Marduk slaying her Is classic order vs chaos simile.

From that point you can go two ways about it. Medusa who was mortal became demi-servant Tiamat or in Nasuverse story of Medusa directly originate from Tiamat myth, which would make her Tamamo of Tiamath Amaterasu.

Either way Tiamat is monster/chaotic aspe,ct of Medusa, Anna is her divine aspect (because loli=Goddes), which again perfectly fit theme of duality.

Echidna is most likely completely unrelated

[Thess]

By the way, the official anime website updated, and clarifies Kingu's origin in his profile:

Spoiler for last episode?:

エルキドゥの亡骸に新たな命を入れられて生まれた存在。
An existence born from giving new life to Enkidu's body.

So you know why Gilgamesh refrained from calling him a fake/imposter.